Sir Thomas De Verdon, of Clonmore - Sources needed

has citations and excerpts from medieval MSS -- https://www.de-verdon.uk/

not showing up on Stirnet

Thomas not here -- https://www.google.com/books/edition/3_papers_relating_to_claims_by...

But Sir Thomas is well attested, through mention of his daughters.

Matilda shows up in this chapter, my search says, but I don't have access to it -- https://academic.oup.com/book/12476/chapter-abstract/162108501?redi...

I note that earlier genealogists mention the de Verdon pedigree (it's not online alas) as being problematic.

The de Verdons show up in lots of scholarly articles and books that are either not online or require money or subscriptions.

I would gather that this Thomas is on that pedigree, but I can't find it. Or his lineage specifically.

Doesn't appear to be on Geni already, even in the de Verdun spelling.

We do have Theobald de Verdun, 2nd Lord of Verdun

He has lots of brothers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theobald_de_Verdun,_2nd_Baron_Verdun#...

Theobald de Verdun, 2nd Baron Verdun (1278–1316) was the second and eldest surviving son of Theobald de Verdun, 1st Baron Verdun, of Alton, Staffordshire, and his wife Margery de Bohun.[1][2]. …. [he] lived mainly in Ireland, and held the office of Justiciar of Ireland in 1314-15. His three brothers rebelled against the Crown in 1312-13, but Theobald himself seems to have remained loyal. … The Verdun estates in Ireland passed to his four daughters as co-heiresses. Some of the Verdun estates later came to his surviving brothers, Nicholas and Milo, and passed to their sons.

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References

1. George Edward Cokayne et al - The Complete Peerage, 2nd Edition, Volume XII (part 2), Edited by G. H. White, Pages 250-251 (The St. Catherine Press Limited, 1959)
2. Mark S. Hagger - The Fortunes of a Norman Family - The de Verdun Family in England, Ireland & Wales 1066-1316 (Four Courts Press, 2001)
3. Complete Peerage, 1st edition, volume, page 24 < Archive.Org > a. John Verdon, the 1st s., d. v.p. and s.p. in Ireland, 6 June 1297.

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So that narrows it down, perhaps.

Nicholas de Verdon, Kt.

Milo de Verdon

So what about this?

https://www.de-verdon.uk/

Henry's brother was Sir George Frederic Verdon KCMG CB FRS of Queen Street Melbourne and Alton, Upper Macedon, Victoria, Australia, a well known Australian politician, diplomat and (later) banker. Their father Edward Verdon came from Dublin and was a descendant of Milo de Verdon, a younger brother Theobald II de Verdon, Baron Verdon of Alton in Staffordshire. Milo was the founder of the Verdons of Clonmore in Co. Louth, who produced quite a few priests, both Catholic and Anglican.

Murphy, Denis. “The de Verdons of Louth.” The Journal of the Royal Society of Antiquaries of Ireland 5, no. 4 (1895): 317–28. http://www.jstor.org/stable/25508254.

Says it’s impossible to trace from Nicholas.

From < Jordan (De Exeter) family genealogy >

In Grace’s Annals the following entries of this family are to be found:

A.D. 1312: “Milo De Verdon married the daughter of Richard De Exonia, Dexter, or De Exeter. This great Connaught family of De Exeter assumed at this time the name of Jordan or MacJordan, and Richard De Exonia was Chief Justice in Banco.” (State Papers, Edward II., page 117.)

I found two sons of Milo de Vernon.

James Verdon married Isabella Gaydoun who married Thomas Talbot

Sir Thomas Verdon of Clonmore married Joan Verdon

From “A Calendar of Irish Chancery Letters c. 1244 - 1509” < Patent Roll 12 Richard II > 1321 Feb. 1389

The K. has learned by inquisition lately taken before Thomas Clifford, escheator, that Thomas Verdon kt was seised in his demesne as of fee of the manor of Clonmore, which he held of the K. in chief; and he gave that manor to John Cusak, rector of Rathdromnewe and his heirs forever, without licence. John returned the manor to Thomas [Verdon] and his heirs male, with remainder to James Verdon and his heirs male, and reversion to the right heirs of Thomas, forever. Thomas died without heirs male leaving Joan as a widow, who entered one third [of the manor] as her dower; and James [Verdon], who entered the remaining two thirds, died seised of the same, leaving Isabelle Gaydoun as his widow, who later married Thomas Talbot. Isabelle, widow of James, and Thomas Talbot (who married her), have showed the K. by petition that one third of the remaining two thirds of the manor ought to pertain to them as dower. PARDON to them of trespass committed in this part.

C: NAI, Lodge MS 1, p. 47; RCH; COA, PH 13203, p. 47.

Do the generations work, though?

“Her father was a grand-nephew of Theobald de Verdun, 2nd Baron Verdun (died 1316).[1]”

Which implies

Milo
Son
Then Sir Thomas of Clonmore

We don’t know all of Milo’s children, so move “unknown” to one of his. That results in

Sir Thomas Verdon of Clonmore is Theobald de Verdun, 2nd Lord of Verdun's great nephew.
https://www.geni.com/path/Theobald-de-Verdun-2nd-Lord-of-Verdun+is+related+to+Sir-Thomas-Verdon-of-Clonmore?from=6000000001891596714&path_type=blood&to=6000000189901505826

Theobald de Verdun, 2nd Lord of Verdun → Milo de Verdon his brother → unknown Verdon his son → Sir Thomas Verdon of Clonmore his son

NB we know Thomas’ father had at least one brother with sons, because Matilda Verdon was set aside in inheriting property in favor of male cousins. This implies she was the eldest child of eldest son of eldest son, I think.

Oh no, we got it wrong! It’s actually simpler.

Thomas was the son of Nicholas, son of Milo.

• 1. Smith, Brendan. Crisis and Survival in Late Medieval Ireland: the English of Louth and their Neighbours 1330-1450 Oxford University Press 2013. p. 63-65. < GoogleBooks >

I’ve also uploaded the pages to profiles, and we can fill in the cousins.

https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000192530044829

This might be easier to see. It’s all Anne Brannen’s mention.

Crisis and Survival in Late Medieval Ireland: The English of Louth and Their ... By Brendan Smith. (2013). Page 18. < GoogleBooks >

And even easier:

Crisis and Survival in Late Medieval Ireland: The English of Louth and Their ... By Brendan Smith. (2013). Page 19. < GoogleBooks >

I’ve updated the profile for Theobald de Verdun, 1st Baron Verdun also.

It’s really helpful to make these connections.

And, it turns out, this is an interesting family, place and time, no wonder it’s prominent in the 2013 study. Hopefully now we’ve publicized it in genealogy.

Thomas Verdon was raised in Lancashire, England while his mother stayed in Ireland. He was attached to the household of Henry Plantagenet of Grosmont, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 4th Earl of Leicester and Lancaster, KG His wardship had been granted to Lancaster’s sister, Maud of Lancaster, Countess of Ulster who was the daughter in law of Elizabeth de Clare, 11th Lady of Clare the widow of Thomas Verdon’s uncle, Theobald de Verdun, 2nd Lord of Verdun See Brendan Smith, p. 35: < GoogleBooks >; (document attached).

Private User If you have a chance, can you describe these turbulent times for English nobility with property interests in Wales & Ireland? Big picture.

I’m reading the page for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_of_Grosmont,_Duke_of_Lancaster, “the wealthiest and most powerful peer of the realm.”

Sure! I’m resting at the moment and about to take more painkillers and do the Rehab Exercise Invented In Hell, after which I’m going to rest some more, but if my brain is working tomorrow I will try to Explain All.

I’m hoping this will be fun for you, and will forgive blips easily.:). It’s been a long time since I read Barbara Tuchman’s “ A Distant Mirror: The Calamitous 14th Century” < Wikipedia > and surely it didn’t cover Ireland?

Wikipedia says: “ More is known about Lancaster's character than that of most of his contemporaries through his memoirs, the Livre de Seyntz Medicines ("Book of the Holy Doctors"), a highly personal treatise on matters of religion and piety, also containing details of historical interest. It reveals that Lancaster, at the age of 44 when he wrote the book in 1354, suffered from gout.[6]

For genealogists, Wikipedia has a “Genealogical table”

A third generation of the House of Lancaster, Henry was related to the most prominent people in early 14th-century England.[148]

Looking at the Wikipedia page for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maud_of_Lancaster,_Countess_of_Ulster

Following the death of Ralph de Ufford on 9 April 1346 at Kilmainham, Maud once again returned to England. On a date between 8 August 1347 and 25 April 1348, she became a canoness at the Augustinian Campsey Priory in Suffolk. In 1364, she transferred to the Poor Clares at Bruisyard Abbey. She died there on 5 May 1377 at the age of about sixty-seven years. She was buried in Bruisyard Abbey.

Since Thomas Verdon’s father died 1347, is it fair to assume the wardship was granted at his death, and Maud would have instantly transferred it over to her brother Henry? I’m thinking Thomas wouldn’t have been sent to live in a convent.

Thomas Verdon’s mother, Matilda Bermingham was not the daughter of John de Bermingham, 1st Earl of Louth but was likely related.

He was the commander of the the Battle of Faughart, the decisive battle in the Irish Bruce Wars 1315–1318. In this battle, Edward de Bruce, Earl of Carrick, King of Ireland was killed, and Bermingham had Bruce's severed head 'salted in a chest' and transported to England to be put on display before Edward II.

An article about his life also describes the character of Edward Bruce, and perhaps motives behind his invasion of Ireland, that created chaos for the Anglo-Normans of Ireland.

https://archive.org/details/livesofillustrio01willuoft/page/356/mod...

This Atlas / encyclopedia page from 1900 is more illuminating than Wikipedia about Louth in Ireland:

https://archive.org/details/atlascyclopediao00joyc/page/n199/mode/1up

Some more Irish Verdon family mentioned here, although there’s no continuity from the 14th century to the 17th.

1. D'Alton, John. King James's Irish Army List. Privately Published Dublin 1860. “Sutherland’s Horse: Cornet William Verdon.” pp. 219–222. < Archive.Org > CORNET WILLIAM VERDON. The subordinate rank of this officer here, evinces how much this once illustrious family had then declined from its early and influential character. … His namesake and descendant, John Verdon, (titularly) styled of Clonmore, was attainted in 1691, while the name of this William, who must have been of the family, does not appear in the Outlawries, nor does any other Verdon on this Army List.

It looks like Irish Verdons can be traced to current day.

https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/MS_UR_090407 National Library of Ireland, Dublin. Manuscripts Reading Room Call number Mss. 8509-8513 History of the Family of De Verdon, 1066-1936, in 4 Vols., Including Some Account of Their Association With County Louth, Compiled From Drawings and Records By Owen Verdon and Others, 1916 - 1936.