Alan de Winton and Margaret Heiress Seton BAD MERGE??

Margaret de Seton, heiress of Seton

Sir Alan de Wyntoun, of Seton

Alan de Seton

The Alan de Seton looks to be born in England, and Alan de Winton born in Scotland.

Margaret de Seton

And both Alan's and Margaret's ARE MASTER PROFILES!!!

I can't vouch for the accuracy here but it's a check for the tree

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_of_Winton

Paternal line
Walter "Dougall" de Seton (b.c 1060, Scotland)
Alexander de Seton (b.c.1087)
Philip de Seton (b.c.1135)
Alexander II Setoun de Wintoun, Knight (b.1164)
Alan Lord Wintoun of Soltre (d.c.1214)
3rd Lord Winton (c.1200)
A Winton (c.1250)
Alan Winton (b.1274)
Alan de Wyntoun of Seton (b.1291) (married Margaret de Seton)

And therefore - not his parents.

Disconnected from Richard de Seton & Alice de Seton

Private User shall we try and find Alan Winton (b.1274)

Sir Alan de Wyntoun, of Seton

Private User

Can you compare trees of Alan de Seton & Sir Alan de Wyntoun, of Seton

Looking at the children & ancestors?

Yes Alan de Winton's children are Christian of dunbar and march, Henry de Winton, William Winton 1st lord Seton, and Sir John de Seton and it looks to be Alexander Winton of Seton that there is a record for. I DO NOT recall a Hatfield family with this profile,,, OR his fathers name being Richard Seton and from England???

Thanks Erica Howton That is how I remember history and sources being written. Alan of Winton that married Margaret Heiress of Seton was born in Scotland at.... http://www.wintonhouse.co.uk/

Alan Winton is Ian Winton's 20th great grandfather!

http://www.geni.com/path/Ian-Winton+is+related+to+Alan-Winton?from=...

This family of Seton became Winton de Seton with the marriage of Walter, (Dougall "the Black Stranger”) de Seton to the Earl of Winchester/Winton Daughter Jonet Seton The de Quincy family is the original holders of the Noble title de Winton. Robert de Quincy he says that Dougall Seton married Jennet Quintsey daughter to Rodger Quintsey Earle of Wintone Constable of Scotland By which marriage it appears the said Dougall Seton gott the lands of Winton Now though there is some error in regard to the date and the marriage for Dougall is said to have lived a full century before Roger de Quinci who died in 1264 it shows the family belief that Winton came through some De Quinci connexion which the Setons perpetuated in their title They also adopted the De Quinci crest the wyvcrn or dragon seen on the beautiful seal of the Constable in 1250 Laing's Cat No 082 and two dragons still form the supporters of the Earl of Eglinton and Winton the male representative of this distinguished house which as their old chronicler remarks hes bein verray ancyent and honorable. Lord Henry Scott in his recent able address to the Historical Section of the Archaeological Institute at Southampton traced the title of Winton borne by the bishops of the see from the Caer Gwent of the Britons through the Venta of the Romans If my conjecture is borne out by evidence then we have an antiquity for the lineage of the Scottish Winton equalled by few titles in the Peerage That the Setons like other well known families had an English connexion appears from Dugdale Baronage ii p 736. This is where the Green wyvern/dragon comes from in the coat of arms.

So it's Agnes de Hatfield who does not match the Scots family.

Can you also look at Margaret de Seton (parents) compared to Margaret de Seton, heiress of Seton (parents)

Wikipedia has

Earls of Winton
Maternal ancestors of the 1st Lord Seton

Walter "Dougall" de Seton (b.c 1060, Scotland)
Alexander de Seton (b.c.1087)
Philip de Seton (b.c. 1135)
Alexander II Setoun de Wintoun, Knight (b.1164)
Adam de Seton (b.c. 1190 and d. 1249)
Christopher de Seton (d.1269)
Christopher de Seton (d.1298)
Christopher de Seton, Knight (b.1240 and d.1307)
Alexander de Seton, Knight (b.c. 1242 and d. 1307)
Sir Alexander IV Seton, Knight (b.c. 1266 and d. 1350)
Margaret de Seton (b.c. 1325) (married Alan de Wyntoun)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_of_Winton

But does not list a mother

Agnes Hatfield looks to be her daughter in this other profile. I don't think that's right. I have never seen records of Hatfields in Scotland. The mothers of Margaret Heiress dont't match either, Margaret with "NO" picture's mother is Margaret Murray and Margaret with a picture's mother is Christian Cheyne

Christian Seton (Cheyne) is what I have always seen and probably where her grand-daughter Lady Christian Seton, Countess of Dunbar & March her name from.

But I have seen a Hatfield related to the Scottish Winton de Seton in any record at that time period.

Although this area of Alan de Winton and Margaret Heiress of Seton is a area that looks to need some resolution. I think there has been an attempt to hide some records because they are supposed kissing cousins??

The way it is now I am showing Agnes de Hatfield showing up a couple generations later with a mother Margaret de Seton. http://www.geni.com/path/Ian-Winton+is+related+to+Agnes-de-Hatfield... Agnes de Hatfield is Ian Winton's second cousin 19 times removed!

I have done some research in the area of Seton of Winton family and think we probably better find some solid sources before we try changing history.
http://www2.thesetonfamily.com:8080/peerage/Peerage_and_Roles.htm Before the Lords were created, the Seton family maintained a tradition of Knights, for thirteen generations, until the mid-14th century, and passed this training through hereditary means to every son of the House. The first created Lord in Scotland was Sir William Seton, son of the heiress Margaret Seton and Alan de Winton, and grandson of Sir Alexander Seton, of Berwick Castle fame. The Lord's Seton were the premier barons of Scotland and heirs to the Earldom of Winchester and later the Earldom of Buchan, and becoming Earls of Huntly, Winton, Dunfermline, Eglinton and Chancellor's of Scotland.

Source= http://www2.thesetonfamily.com:8080/

Myrna Huthmacher, (C) is Ian Winton's 9th cousin twice removed!

I see NO sources listed for the profiles without pictures. I would like to see some sources or documentation of records for the decent of Margaret de Seton
Alan de Seton and Agnes de Hatfield I don't understand how they can be Master Profiles without a SOURCE or documentation?

Ian I think you're nailing it & studying this Agnes Hatfield is key. Generational mixup somewhere with similarly named Seton's in England.

Catherine Seton was entirely in the wrong place.

Can anyone identify her parents please and add a reference to the profile "overview"?

Private User

I think I've got it mostly straightened out -- your check appreciated